Wheelie look funny, but the Fallen look amazing!

Wheelie looks like Wall-E... Wheel-E??

Fallen looks like a lizard-man.

why dose Wheelie look like he wants to eat me

I guess Wheelie has the puffy cloud effect on people... when they look at him, he looks like different things to everyone.
I was thinking he looked like Johny-5 from Short Circuit... except with teeth.
But does anyone else notice he has some "Mech Alive" feature, which has something to do from changing factions???
What's up with that?
As for the Fallen, I hadn't realized he was an actual character, I guess Bay's disinformation tricked me. But The Fallen does look interesting though. I too hope he gets made into a Voyager at least.

Actually Overhaul, Mech Alive is a new feature that theyre putting into the new movie line, just like they did with Automorph for the other movie figs. When you move a certain joint on the figure, you should be able to see gears or something moving within that figure. The changing factions thing just happens to be labeled right underneath it.

Im going to need to see more on these figures to decide whether or not ill get them.

Sounds & looks like Wheelies Autobot chest logo is the "mech alive" moving part, im betting it spins round to reveal a Decepticon one...maybe he joins up with the Autobots at some point...

And im a bit unimpressed with that Fallen figure, hopefully they do one thats not as green & drab!

I'm really impressed by The Fallen. While not very similar at all to his original design, he does have at least one feature reminiscent of him—the internal furnace as revealed by the orange coming out of various grooves. The only thing I which they'd do different is the green color. I think black is much more fitting. The Egyptian motif, though, is brilliant, and works really well for the character.

I cant access the forums, it says i'm not authorized

Overhaul, you've never heard of The Fallen?

http://tfwiki.net/wiki/The_Fallen

Wheelie STILL looks like a twerp

Finally, after 20 years of waiting, we get a toy of Johnny-5! :P

Edit: Ah wait. Somebody else already mentioned he looks like Johnny-5. Now I don't feel as clever anymore. Plus, I didn't even notice the obvious homage to Wall-E until I read someone else's comment.

fallen already told me this information.

starscreamer so what do you think about wheelie and the fallen figures?

i think ill be buying these two

...OMFG IT WHEELIE

Sabrblade, I have indeed heard of the Fallen from the War Within: The Dark Ages comic.
However, one of the speculated meanings to what "The Fallen" might be for this movie were some of the Decepticons (namely Megatron) who were returning for revenge. A product of the rumor mill apparently, since it looks like they will be having this film feature the comic inspired character.
I must admit some fear over what they will do with the character, however, since in the comic, the character seems to have been working as a servant of Unicron.

Well, I'm still wondering if he's gonna be the same The Fallen from The War Within. Cuz there have been several versions of Transformers with the same names, so this demonic character could either be the same or a different The Fallen than the first The Fallen.

But if the two are the same guy, then there will have to be some explanation of how he got from Primax 1002.9 Gamma to Tyran 609.26 Delta.

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Okay, Fallen looks like something off of an Iron Maiden album cover while Wheelie looks like the second cousin twice removed of the robot from Short Circuit.

I actually like the new look for Wheelie, which looks like Wall-E, which was designed looking like Johnny-5, its an old design, but I still like it. As for the Fallen, I don't know about the action figure. I will reserve judgement until I see it up close.

So, is he an Autobot or, a Decepticon? The Fallen looks like Leader Class Megatron from the first movie. His transformation looks the same,too. Why copy a bad design in the first place? As I recall, Johnny-5 had tracks, not wheels. He only had a caster wheel in the back for balance. Wheelie looks good, though in both modes. Add the same colors he had in G 1 & he would be Wheelie for sure.

Anybody else think it's kind of funny how Wheelie ranks pretty low in most everything, but has an endurance rank of 9???
So Sabrblade, what is Primax 1002.9 Gamma and Tyran 609.26 Delta?
I mean, I've read all the War Within comics, I've got the last two issues of the More than Meets the Eye comic (the last issue tells about The Fallen), but I'm really not sure what you're talking about here.
But Bay does have a way of rewriting stuff, but then again, the same can be said of most conversions of a story loosely based on the source material.

oh sweet!

I'm begining to wonder if they decided to change the story from the original stuff and The Fallen is Jetfire.

My guess is probably not, but it is surprising just how similar they seem. Assuming the scene of Wheelie finding Jetfire in the Museum is true, I don't see how they could be the same, but at this point if somehow we start with the Fallen and end with Jetfire - or we find that the Fallen and Jetfire ended up on Earth about the same time, I won't be shocked.

The Fallen and Jetfire are not the same guy. They are too different to be the same person. Jetifre is said to be a Decepticon who becomes an Autobot and merges with Oprimus. The Fallen is a demonic being of pure evil.

Overhaul, to answer your question, Primax 1002.9 Gamma is the Universal Stream in which The War Within comic series resides in, and Tyran 609.26 Delta is the Universal Stream in which the TF: Revenge of the Fallen movie takes places in.

sabrblade how do you figure this delta ,gamma,beta,omega,etc stuff out

Alpha—animated series
Beta—tech spec/toy/pack-in comic only ("box")
Gamma—comic book series
Delta—motion picture/live action
Epsilon—club/convention fiction
Zeta—text stories, storybooks and other prose works (printed)
Eta—radio/audiocentric universes, books on tape
Theta—live performance/spoken word
Iota—Internet-only information (not involved with club/convention)
Kappa—games (video and otherwise)

???
Ok, I understand the alphabet, but where's this whole concept coming from? I would think one would just say "War Within universe to live action movie 'verse".
As for being the same character, I'm betting he's as much the same character as the previous movies Optimus Prime was the same character as W.W. Prime. Intended to be the same, just that they both existed in their repective realities.

It comes from the various TransTech stories.

You can find out more here:
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Universal_stream
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/TransTech

I wouldn't say that Movie Optimus Prime and G1 Optimus Prime are the same guy. There are too many differences between them. The only things they have in common are their names, voice actors, positions, and type of altmode.

The Fallen, like Prima, Vector Prime, the Liege Maximo, and Alpha Trion (among others) are members of a group called the "Original 13" they were the first Transformers created by Primus on Cybvertron. Each is guardian of one aspect of reality, Vecotr Prime was guardian of Space and Time, the Fallen was guardian of the universal force of Entropy. As such, these particular beings are, by necessity, multiversal singularities like Primus and Unicron, either traveling between realities (Vector Prime), or existing simultaneously in them all (Alpha Trion). It's likely that The Fallen exists in some shape in every reality at once. He's the same being, but looks somewhat different in each reality. Apparently, in Toyfare #140, Lorenzo DeBoneventura confirmed that The move character is indeed The Fallen of the Original 13. http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-news-rumors/218756-toyfare-140-rotf-coverage.html

(Can someone please tell me how to make a hyperlink in these comments?)

The Liege Maxmio and Alpha Trion are not offical members of the original thirteen TFs.

The only official members known are Vector Prime, The Fallen, Prima, and the unnamed Prime that is the combined form of Skyfall, Landquake, Breakaway, Topspin, and Heatwave.

Simon Furman has gone on record saying that Maximo is one of them. This was established even in G2, and is even mentioned in the Ultimate Guide, and he's supposed to be in the upcoming "The Thirteen", so is Alpha Trion. Also, Alpha Trion is specifically stated as being a "first generation product of Vector Sigma", which is Primus. His MtMtE profile also puts it forth that he's believed to be one if them. And Primus used him as his link to the other Transformers as stated in the Ultimate Guide and in the "Universe" stories. Yes, he's one of the Thirteen.

The Liege Maximo was stated to be one of them in Alighnment, but that story is unoffical and its canonicity is debatable.

As for Alpha Trion, it's never been outright stated that he is.

And don't ever go by what The Ultimate Guide said. It's loaded with errors.

Just look here to see who is and isn't confirmed to be members:
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/13_Original_Transformers

I've read that article many times, and it's not entirely accurate.

Maximo's place as one of them is also mentioned in the Ultimate Guide. On top of that, in the last issue of G2, Maximo specifically stated that he was created at the same time as the first Prime. The first Prime was Prima. Maximo is Prima's twin. Also, yes, Alpha Trion did state he was one of the first. In "The Key to Vector Sigma part 2", Alpha Trion specifically says—and I quote— "I am a first generation product of Vector Sigma." IT is his being a First Generation Transformer that makes him able to act as a Key to Vector Sigma himself and to merge with it. So yes, it has been flat out stated that he is one of the very first Transformers; one of the original Thirteen.

In Simon Furman's most recent discussion about the new miniseries about the Original Thirteen, he states flat out that Maximo and Alpha Trion are on the list of members he's planning on using. And, while "Alignment itself is unofficial, it has been specifically referenced in numerous other stories, and it was indeed specifically Furman's intent to ewstablish Maximo as one of the Thirteen. This is stated here:

"Although the Generation 2 comic was cancelled before the true nature of the Liege Maximo could be revealed, Simon Furman was ultimately able to see his ideas for the character through to conclusion in the unofficial novella, "Alignment". Although "Alignment" was produced without permission of Hasbro and is thus considered non-canon, it explains that the Liege Maximo was one of the 13 original Transformers created by Primus, who, unlike his fellows, had chosen not to subdivide repeatedly, doing so only selectively, creating a small taint in the Transformer race which spread through subsequent generations, ultimately flowering with the rise of the Decepticons. Because of this sparse sub-division, the Liege Maximo's connection to the divine origins of the Transformer race was comparatively undiluted, and he sought to embrace it. To this end, he instructed Jhiaxus and the Cybertronian Empire to subject various planets to eco-structuring, which were steadily woven together to form the Hub, a massive resonating structure that would allow him to ascend to the realm of the gods. Two Transformer groups, one led by Grimlock and one by Ultra Magnus and Megatron, disrupted this process by forcing the Liege to leave his corporeal body, then destroying both it and his portal. Left with nowhere to go, the Liege Maximo's essence dissipated, and he was destroyed."
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Liege_Maximo

On page 75 of the Ultimate Guide it says, "in its own way, 'Alignment' is fan fiction.Though it answers some questions (for instance the Liege Maximo is indeed one of the Original 13), the official conclusion to G2 remains untold."

From the TFWiki page on "Alignment" and it's relation to other works:

""Alignment" served to answer several of the questions surrounding the mysterious entity, the Liege Maximo, that the Generation 2 comics raised. The story explained, as the comics had hinted, <b>that the Liege Maximo was one of the first Transformers created by Primus,</b> who sought to reconnect with the divine origins of the Transformers by gaining access to the realm of the gods. This was the reason for the eco-structuring that Jhiaxus and the Cybertronian Empire were subjecting planets throughout the galaxy to during the Generation 2 series—this interconnected series of metallic worlds formed the "Hub", a resonant structure that would allow the Liege Maximo to accomplish his goal.
The story also served to form an explicit link between the (Marvel Comics version of the) Generation 1 time period and the recently-concluded Beast Era. It is noted that while the Decepticons are leaderless on New Cybertron, the Decepticon High Council were unable to agree upon a course of action to further the Decepticon cause. Specifically, a splinter group referring to itself as the Predacons advocates "unconditional surrender to the Autobots, a pooling of resources, an extended time of gathering and secret re-building"—this, of course, being the tactic of the Tripredacus Council. At the conclusion of the story, this is ultimately the voice which wins out. Additionally, energon depletion forms a major part of the story, and to overcome it, the concept of downsizing the Transformers' physical forms is introduced."

"
The Furman-penned "Transformers: The Ultimate Guide" made reference to "Alignment," explicitly noting that it was unofficial, <b>but reiterating the Liege Maximo's status as one of the group fiction now referred to as the 13 original Transformers.</b> "Alignment" was also responsible for coining the name "Galvatron II" to refer to the Galvatron introduced in "Rhythms of Darkness!", which was later officialized by e-Hobby when they used it as the name of their exclusive version of the 2003 Galvatron reissue. Furthermore, the storyline which accompanied the e-Hobby Laser Ultra Magnus reissue described this Galvatron as possessing a Warworld, apparently taking its cue from the backstory briefly covered in "Alignment."
"Alignment" also featured the first mentions of Iacon's Stellar Galleries, and the Decepticons' fortress, Kolkular, both of which later appeared in Dreamwave Productions comic books.]"

It was always Furman's intent that Maximo be one of the Thirteen. Maximo was designed specifically as one.

What about that you said about one Alpha Trion existing in multiple realities?

Alpha Trion has been shown in canon to appear in virtually every TF reality. He's in the Sunbow/BW, "Universe" reality, in RiD (he created Ultra Magnus and Optimus Prime), in Animated (as to be revealed in Season three), In "Timelines", In the UT reality (through TFCC "Cybertron" comics), etc. Alpha Trion is Primus' chosen guardian of Cybertron and Vector Sigma. As such, he needs to exist simultaneously on every Cybertron. His appearance differs slightly (just as Primus' appearance differs somewhat from one reality to the next), but he is the same character. Vector Prime, however, travels between realities and thus always looks the same.

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Tramp said, - 2009-02-12 20:09:27
In Simon Furman's most recent discussion about the new miniseries about the Original Thirteen, he states flat out that Maximo and Alpha Trion are on the list of members he's planning on using. And, while "Alignment itself is unofficial, it has been specifically referenced in numerous other stories, and it was indeed specifically Furman's intent to ewstablish Maximo as one of the Thirteen. This is stated here:bye